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I truly think the possibility should be removed. Nuka is most definately Scar's son. Zira's obsessing over Scar and their similar appearances all point to him.Werebereus 14:34, May 2, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
There's a lot of evidence. But there's still no proof. We don't want to be spreading false information just because it's strongly hinted at; we can still include it in his trivia. --HoneyfurBob's Your Uncle! 23:06, May 2, 2011 (UTC)
Alright.Werebereus 00:56, May 3, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
What I think we should do[]
We should solve this debate about who the parents of Vitani, Nuka, and Kovu is old fashion style. Get ready for it...THEORIES! Since the word from the directo himself is unclear(Zira would be on the royal family tree if she was Scar's mate. By obscuring her Lineage they obscured her place on the tree. This is contradicted by the 'we made her just a follower' statement and the fact the picture could've very well been edited.Werebereus 17:34, May 20, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
Zira is the mother of Kovu, Nuka, and Vitani; their father is unknown. Scar is unlikely the father of Nuka and Vitani as they never refer to Scar as their father not one time. For the last time, Rooney wrote they obsured her lineage to make her a follower which translates to "her background is unknown so she's just a follower". Quit taking Rooney out of context. And, there's no way Rooney's profile picture could have been edited. It's Darrell Rooney, believe it. Also, there's no need for fan theories on this wiki which is meant to post ONLY official information. Chris14 (talk)
What Chris just said is exactly what we're trying to tell you, Werebereus: we are an OFFICIAL wiki that's supposed to be displaying OFFICIAL information. Fan theories are not official. Speculation, sure, but in trace amounts, not everywhere. --HoneyfurBob's Your Uncle! 20:38, May 20, 2011 (UTC)
Zira is the mother of Kovu, Nuka, and Vitani: Their father is unknown but very likely to be Scar due to the fact all the outlanders were designed in Scar's image in the first place. Kovu is said to be of no relation to Scar but Nuka and Vitani are kept in the dark. Rooney says her relation to him is obscured to make her a follower which is akin to saying 'I don't know but this is it' meaning he just contradicted himself. You two aren't taking into accound the reply could've been edited and STILL no link has been provided the conversation.
Why is there no link? Why should i believe a picture that could've very well been edited? Why hasn't the poster of the picture joined in either of these arguments? Simple. The poster claims s/he talked to rooney but the name is blotted it out. Why? What's the point? Hasn't she already revealed herself? Here's why I think:
The conversation was edited, and though no one would probably think about this possibility(example: you two), there was a small chance someone(aka me) would figure it out. If malmisa or whatever their name is talked to rooney why does their name appear? Why is she being anonymous? Because if anyone found out all fingers would point to her. She could easily say 'That wasn't me and you have no proof. Don't you see the name blotted out?'
I'm going to talk to her about and until I come back, I ask no changes be made to anything.Werebereus 23:46, May 21, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
I still don't believe the conservation was edited. Why did MsIsamisa blot her user name during the conservation? Beats me. But, since you say you are going to talk her, then, that's good. She can talk to Rooney again, and hopefully end this debate over Zira being Scar's mate and Nuka and Vitani being Scar's cubs ONCE AND FOR ALL! User:Chris14 (talk)
She didn't want to display her Facebook profile on the internet (which isn't a bad idea). And the point is, with or without Rooney's confirmation, no one knows who fathered Nuka and Vitani. What's the fun of stories if we can't invent and imagine some things on our own? --HoneyfurBob's Your Uncle! 03:41, May 22, 2011 (UTC)
Now, to all those who think Scar had no children, just because Kovu is not the biological child of Scar dosen't mean that Nuka and/or Vitani aren't his as well? After all, while granted their father is never mentioned, who ever said that Nuka, Vitani, and Kovu even have the same father? Where in the film does it say that the 3 are even full siblings? If anything, Nuka could have a different father than his brother and sister or Nuka and Vitani could have the same father while Kovu's is different. In the wild, not all cubs born in the same litter all across Africa and India have the same father. Even if there are only 2 cubs they could still have different fathers. And another thing, Kovu is mentioned as the ADOPTED son of Scar, so who's do say that Kovu is not also the adopted son of Zira as well, with no blood relation to her and, to extent, Nuka and Vitani? Kids who are adopted will call their adopted parents "Mom" and "Dad" (obviousily) inspite of there being no blood relation. One last thing, Scar,as king, needed heirs, He needed someone to succeed him as the ruler of the pridelands. Someone of his own flesh and blood. A child. He could very well be the biological father of Nuka and, possibly, Vitani. Just because the film never officially states it and just because Nuka and Vitani have constantly called him Scar does not mean there isn't a possibility of them being related. 71.185.227.7 19:05, June 11, 2013 (UTC)
It was stated by someone who worked on the film that Scar did not father any of Zira's children, so no. It's not possible in the canon-verse.
Werebereus, we already had this vote on Vitani's talk page. It was a draw, so we left it in the trivia. Please don't bring this up again. --HoneyfurI'm surrounded by idiots. 16:51, June 15, 2011 (UTC)
Why not? Tell me why I shouldn't? If we can vote on Nala being Simba's queen if it's never said, we can do the same for Nuka. And we didn't do that already. We voted wether we should put the "Mate" thing on Zira's page or not.Werebereus 16:54, June 15, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
Nunka[]
In the Variety it is revealed a lion, who was the son of Scar and Ziraa, was to fall in love with Aisha(later named Kiara). This name Nunka means nothing in no language, so it's obviously a Typo. Hell, they even mention Simba and Scar are brothers then go on to say "Can Simba accept the son of the lion who killed his father?".
I think this is proof Nuka is Scar's son. "Nunka" was voiced by Andy Dick, so is Nuka, Nunka IS Nuka, Nuka is Scar's son.Werebereus 14:27, July 5, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
Werebereus, this is not proof. You're just assuming it's a typo. And even if it is, it's not canon, since the whole movie script was changed after this. Kiara wasn't even Kiara in this version of the film; she was Aisha. I don't want to start another argument. We had this vote on Vitani's talk page months ago. --HoneyfurI'm surrounded by idiots. 14:30, July 5, 2011 (UTC)
The whole movie script wasn't changed. And you and I both know some information can't be found in the movies, only in the credits or the script.
Like Sarafina, we didn't know her name until we saw it in the credits.
Or Esperanza from the movie "Spirit". Her name was mentioned in the script for the movie.
The SP official script isn't available, and official documentations from primary source(Like Proud of Simba's Pride) never say anything about a rewrite.Werebereus 14:44, July 5, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
It's obvious they rewrote the script because the article states that Scar's son (who was Nunka in an early script) falls in love with Simba's daughter, and we know this was changed so that Kovu, the renamed Nunka, is Scar's adopted son in the final film. It doesn't take that much just to figure that out. User:Chris14 (talk) 21:43, 5 July 2011 (UTC)
Citations[]
Chris, you're citations are pathetic. One is from an UNOFFICIAL site with no citations itself and the other is just some crap you wrote yourself. Nunka was voiced by Andy dick, NUKA is voiced by Andy Dick. Nuka IS Nunka. Kovu is a COMPLTETELY different character.Werebereus 19:43, August 8, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
Talking to you is like talking to a brick wall. Nunka was a name tossed around for Scar's son same as Kovu, Werebereus. The Encyclopedia stated Nunka was a "possible name for Scar's son and Shani/Aisha's (both working names for Kiara) boyfriend in the upcoming sequel (see Kovu). I know the encyclopedia says it's unofficial, but if Nunka was Nuka, it would have said, see Nuka. But, it doesn't. The Variety magazine stated Nunka was Scar's son in the script at the time. So, Nunka is Kovu because Nunka/Kovu fall for Simba's daughter. Plus, it says "unofficial" because it was being written at the same time TLKII was in production, and a lot of stuff was unclear at the time such as whether Chaka was a boy or girl.
Now you are saying the other site was some crap I wrote, but does it look like I wrote that? I was four years old when this movie was being made, and that’s not even my real name. The second article said somewhere, "Andy Dick is thought (though not yet confirmed) to play Nuka, who may well be Scar's son, but not THE Scar's son that Simba's daughter is involved with." Since the article was written in 1998, therefore, it was a later script than the one with Nunka and Aisha released in 1997. How Dick ended up with Nuka remains unknown. But, Nunka and Nuka are not the same characters as Nunka was a name tossed around for Scar's heir who falls for the daughter of Simba. You are just speculating that Nunka is Nuka with little proof to show that.
Also, Nuka still isn't Scar's son because it was never mentioned in the final film he is, and Rooney confirmed he wasn't when he stated Zira was not the mate of Scar. Chris14 (talk) 22:32, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
It's unnoficial. And that being said I don't care what it tells me to "see". Andy Dick voiced Nuka AKA NUNKA and Nuka's resemblance to Scar is UNCANNY. They're names sound alike, like CRAZY.
And actually, now that I think about...NOWHERE does any primary source say "Kovu was previously related to Scar, but it was changed due to the incestous undertone". It's much more like Nuka was supposed to be Kiara's beloved, but then Kovu was added so incest wouldn't be a problem. Disney changes little things like this so the parents watching won't go into an uproar over the mere CONCEPT of the idea. Bambi and Faline are cousins in the original story, but not in the Disney one, and there are no indications Disney even considered the idea in that movie.
And at this point I dont CARE what Rooney said. He said their relationship was obscure AND the she was just a follower. He obviously doesn't know what the hell he's talking about, not to mention the MOVIE even provides proof Scar and Zira were mates to some degree:
Mating isn't just about sex, but the raising of the resulting offspring and Zira's line about "Scar is gone but Zira's still around" confirms it. They WERE mates, no matter what Rooney said. The Movie confirmed it, I have a book confirming it, the hinted at deleted scene confirmed it, it's true.Werebereus 22:46, August 8, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
And again, where's your proof that Nunka is Nuka? Nuka's resemblance to Scar is irrelevant, as Kovu shares some resemblance to Scar, but he isn't Scar's son. Also, how many websites do I need to throw at you so you can see Nunka is Kovu. Because here is another one: http://www.lionking.org/characters/TLK_Character_List.html. Scroll down to the bottom of the page where it says "Dropped characters and working names". It proves my point. Was Kovu's relationship to Scar changed because of incest? Probably was, because that's why Rooney stated in the email that Eisner wanted to avoid making Kovu and Kiara cousins. Read the email again. Chris14 (talk) 23:17, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
Where is your proof KOVU is Nunka? I stand by my Andy Dick argument: You have NOTHING but speculation and no. Kovu doesn't resemble Scar in any other way than coloration. They have three similarities where as Nuka and Scar are basically clones of each other. Another fan site? Good for you Chris.
The email also says "their son". Kovu is obviously not this son, so it's Nuka. Nuka is their son.
Actually, now that i think about it, Rooney never gave HIS opinion on the matter. He was asked what he thought, but instead present Eisner's opinion instead. Rooney, the director, never answered the question. He gave Eisner's answer instead. So he confirmed nothing so my book still stands. And you still haven't offered an argument to this: "
Mating isn't just about sex, but the raising of the resulting offspring and Zira's line about "Scar is gone but Zira's still around" confirms it. They WERE mates, no matter what Rooney said. The Movie confirmed it, I have a book confirming it, the hinted at deleted scene confirmed it, it's true"Werebereus 00:04, August 9, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
I provided my websites that proof Nunka was Kovu, as the son of Scar falls in love with the daughter of Simba in an early script, which somewhat happens in the final film, with the only difference of Kovu not being Scar's son. You still lack yours, and so what if they are fan sites, it's more proof than you have yet to offer. Also, Kovu and Scar both share similiar eye color if you hadn't noticed. "Their son" is Kovu, as Kovu/Nunka is the chosen heir of Scar; Nuka stated he was never given the chance to have the throne. Rooney started Eisner's opinion because that why's they changed Zira and Kovu from being Scar's kins. Finally, according to YourDictionary.com, it states a mate is "the male or female of animals paired for propagation (reproduction)." So, an animal is not a mate if it raised the cub, only if the animal was involved in sexually reproducing the child can the animal be a mate. Also, one line confirms nothing, only hinted that Scar was possibly involved in raising Kovu.
As for your book, I hate to say this, but it is UNOFFICIAL as your storybook is about as equal as TLK: Six New Adventures. Both were tie-ins with the movies, and merely given Disney's stamp of approval although the film never confirmed what's true in the books. Like Kopa is "Fluffy", when the directors stated the cub has no name, and a sequel came along, and states the cub is a daughter and gave her no older siblings. Also, other books contradict your storybooks (like "Friends in Need" contradicts "A Tale of Two Brothers") as Honeyfur stated she has a TLKII storybook that doesn’t say Zira and Scar are mates. So, the book universe cannot be one entity in itself, therefore unofficial and unreliable. Deleted scenes are not official proof, as they were, well, DELETED. Chris14 (talk) 3:25, 9 August 2011 (UTC)
And i hate too tell you this but you're message may as well been fake. There was never an "Michael Eisner" in SP's creation. I've checked Wikipedia, SP's credits AND IMBD and there was NOTHING. And what other books? WHERE? And screw the deleted scenes, Scar and Zira are mates to some degree, and you cannot dissprove this. Deny it all you want but it'll always be true.
One line changes EVERYTHING. And there was no 'hinting'. "Scar is gone but Zira's still around" CONFIRMS they both had a hand in raising Kovu thus are MATES. Both statements about being mates are true and you just giving me more confirmation. Scar and Zira produced SOMEONE and raised it: Nuka. Darell calls Kovu Scar's Protege and a Protege is a person under the CARE of someone else interested in their future. They are at least Semi-Mates. You CANT argue with this so don't even try. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/protege
Kovu not being Scar's son...And NOT Nunka. Nuka is voiced by Andy dick. Nunka was voiced by Andy dick. Nuka is Nunka.Your fansites were made by fans, just like me. When you give me an official site containg official information from a reliable source, Chris. We'll talk.Werebereus 04:18, August 9, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
Something Interesting[]
...That I think is Trivia worthy...
Zira:Scar...watch over my poor Nuka...
notices Kovu and strikes him*
Zira:What. Have. You. Done?!?
Kovu: I didn't-I didn't mean to I...I did nothing!
Zira: Exactly! And in doing so you betray you Pride...Betray Scar!
We all know Nuka was out for himself; He doesn't want to kill Simba to avenge Scar, he wants to show Kovu up and look better than him. He had nothing to do with Scar, just like Kovu, yet he isn't labeled a traitor...I wonder why that is? Scar's son perhaps? Zira was so indebted to Scar, perhaps she thought any kids by him would be as well. It was clear as day Nuka didn't like Scar, the lion doesn't hesitate to show it in front of Zira(he scoffs and Zira snarls at hiim), yet she still tells Scar to watch over him.
Also, Zira tells Kovu by allowing Nuka to die(even going so far as to blame his death directly on Kovu), he's betrayed not only the Pride, but Scar as well. She clearly wasn't talking about letting Simba get away. Simba isn't even mentioned until later. If Nuka wasn't Scar's son, why would his death mean betrayal? I mean, assuming Vitani isn't related to Scar(I think she is), wouldn't her killing Vitani be traitorous as well? Apparently it's not, as she eagerly goes "this is for you Scar!"
Conclusion: Nuka was allowed to live simply because he was Scar's son. Otherwise, he'd be competition for Kovu and either Scar would've killed him beforehand, or Zira would've killed/exiled him when he was of age. Yet he's still there...and when he dies it's enough to make Zira go "screw stealth, we're just gonna barge in there"Were2 01:24, September 6, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
Eye colour[]
In the elephant graveyard scene (when Nuka's eyes appear green) could Nuka's eyes simply be reflecting the grennish light of the graveyard? Should we add this point in instead of saying that it was a mistake made by the disney animaters?
Then they should be gren all the time in that scene, not flicker back between the two.Werebereus 20:18, December 19, 2011 (UTC)Werebereus
Tigerfan45 (talk) 22:55, November 21, 2015 (UTC)Nuka, Vitani, and Zira on The Lion Guard
Since The Lion Guard is supposed to take place during the second movie, does anyone think Zira, Nuka, and Vitani could appear in it? I'm not confirming this, I'm just saying that it's a very distinct possibility.Tigerfan45 (talk) 22:55, November 21, 2015 (UTC)
I dont think so, I haven't heard anything about TLK 2 antagonists and since the main antagonists are going to be the hyenas, they (well, at least Zira for sure) wouldn't fit their role. PowerOfFailing (talk) 23:08, November 21, 2015 (UTC)
Nuka's Infobox Picture[]
Teenage Nuka if you ever wanna use him as a side infobox picture. ^^
Nuka as an adult and a great picture!
I have a few pictures here that will be a great infobox picture for Nuka. :)
1. The first picture is Nuka as a teenager. I think this picture is a good one for him if you ever wanna use the side infobox picture for teenage Nuka. ^^
2. The second picture is the adult Nuka. I think this one fits Nuka very well and IMO, it shows almost most of his appearence. The beard-like mane on his chin can be seen and his arms are shown. It also shows his true colors as well.
Soooo, what do you all think. Do you think these pictures will be great for Nuka? Or do you think the current picture of Nuka is better? Let me know your thoughts! :) VillainNut (talk) 14:46, March 23, 2017 (UTC)
I like the first one (File:Adult Nuka TLK2.png) all right, but I'm indifferent either way. If other admins like it too, then I'm fine with putting it in as the new infobox picture. :) Queen Kiara 18:03, March 23, 2017 (UTC)
I agree with Pink. The infobox photo should be of Nuka as an adult. However, I think the photo should be expanded a bit to show more of the photo. It currently looks a bit too skinny. --Honeyfur 19:32, March 23, 2017 (UTC)
Hmmm. Let me expand on it a bit more. ^^ I will sent it to you tomorrow. :)
Here is the expanded version here. :) Hope this is to your likeing because Nuka looks great here. It shows more of his appearence and his personality as well. That is why Nuka is my favorite character because of his design and personality, plus his motives. ^^
I will go ahead and add it. Thanks for the suggestion! --Honeyfur 19:30, March 24, 2017 (UTC)
Nuka's Relation To Scar[]
I feel like declaring Nuka unrelated to Scar is a bit of a jump from what Darrell Rooney apparently stated about Scar and Zira's relationship (or 'lineage' as he calls it). You all seem to be mistaking the word Obscured for Omitted. These are not synonyms. One means to hide and the other means to remove. Something that is hidden is still there; something that is removed is not. They had a relationship, but it's original nature was obscured. The result of this obscuring made her present as a simple follower in the film. Again, obscuring doesn't mean omitting.
For whatever reason, this Wiki seems hellbent on making Scar unrelated to Kovu, Nuka, or Vitani. There was never any overwhelming evidence in the films to support this, true, but Kobler has outright stated that -- like Kovu -- Nuka was one of Scar's illegitimate children. The only thing he stated that was changed was Nuka's envy and his physical physique.
The Question asked: "I was wondering if Nuka had any relation to Scar such as being his official son in the Lion King 2 Script"
Answer:
"Yes."
"Kovu was also an illegitimate son"
"But that mean he [Kovu, NOT Nuka] and Kiara were cousins."
"So Kovu was changed to Scar's hand picked heir."
I feel like we should leave whether or not there is a relation up to the reader, or just go ahead and say there was one since the writer himself is saying there was one, but there is no reason to definitively declare they are not father and son.Jaxterhammer (talk) 23:10, April 10, 2019 (UTC)
Forgive me, I did not see his second statement! From what it sounds like, Kopler was never really an authority on the issue in the first place. Still, I maintain that we not make any definitive statements, since these guys don't seem to have a straight story themselves lolJaxterhammer (talk) 23:23, April 10, 2019 (UTC)
Statements made by the creative team cannot be taken as canon. This is why the information is limited to the trivia, so readers can glean what they will from it. --Honeyfur 00:40, April 11, 2019 (UTC)
I mean, you seem to have taken what you've gleaned for it and put it on the article as fact, instead of leaving it open ended. Again, I was making the Trivia a bit less definitive. Her being just a follower doesn't preclude any relation to Scar. Men in positions of power have relations (and children) with underlings all the time. Being the mother of someones children absolutely doesn't there's an active relationship. Anecdotal, but you get the point.Jaxterhammer (talk) 01:50, April 11, 2019 (UTC)
I think the way it is phrased in the article is not suggestive. It simply reiterates Rooney's statement. --Honeyfur 00:42, April 12, 2019 (UTC)
This is kind of a dead horse, but I want to just state that the word "obscure" has more than one usage and all the "Zira is Scar's mate"/"Nuka is his son" debate focuses solely on that one definition of the word. To obscure something doesn't only mean "to hide" it, it also means "to make unclear" or "make difficult to understand". This is the more likely meaning that Rooney intended when he used the word - Zira's relationship was changed to be unclear to the viewer. So is she his mate? Is she not? It's now deliberately unclear, hence why all answers to that question were removed (ie, the cut scene where she calls herself his Queen). It was changed to have no answer. Just wanted to add my two cents' worth. =) Rinjapine (talk) 03:21, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
I would agree, except that Rooney specifies that the relationship was "changed" to make her "just a follower." This means that their original vision of Zira's relationship with Scar was specifically altered to be platonic. However, we don't regard creator statements as canon; rather, we include them as trivia points. In the case of Rooney's statement, we use his language almost exactly to not extrapolate on what he said. --Honeyfur 04:47, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
I wasn't trying to argue for the Zira=mate point or even against it, just saying that I see this talk filled with people using that one word to base their argument on -- that her relationship was only 'hidden' and thus somehow she still exists as Scar's mate in secret, like it's just they veiled it and it's still true/canon underneath. My comment here was more a comment on the fact that words have more than one meaning, and that this was not really "confusion" or even "contradiction" within his statement, as I am seeing people claim. So this was that I thought it amusing the focus was on a single way that word could be used -- yes, it means "hidden" in some situations, but that it also can mean just making the situation "unclear". The word proves nothing, and the way it's being argued is a false 'proof' being tossed about. The movie as it stands does mesh with all Rooney's words, in that Zira appears in the final product as only just a loyal follower, and that her exact relationship (whether she had one or is simply delusional and obsessed) is left unclear and unresolved - we have no more information to answer it either way, in-movie. She's "just a follower" with regards to script and final included scenes, even if you could make a case for why you believe her to be more. =) Rinjapine (talk) 19:10, 2 February 2021 (UTC)
